The finale of the show, the battle at Camlann, the reveal, the death of some characters.
Please discuss.
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Nice!
(Edited by Gwen2626)
Issy5209 wrote:
I'm not sure what else can be said about this final two-parter that hasn't already been said a thousand times over in other threads, and other forums. Yes, it felt very rushed as if they hadn't prepared at all. There were quite a few things that made little or no sense whatsoever. Again it felt as though the writers wanted to put in scenes or just have the actors say certain sentences just for effect, but it didn't matter if they were logical at all. Why else would you show the image of Merlin trapped in a cave, playing on the audiences knowledge of the legends with Merlin trapped beneath a Hawthorne tree, or within a cave. But how it happened - Morgana trapping him there when he was seeking to regain his magic by going to the cave in the first place is simply daft. The scene with Balinor is quite beautiful (although its very Star-Wars-y), but is rendered meaningless by the very scenes following it (where Merlin is in his old-man disguise). As for the battle itself, it felt to me as though they'd watched the movie Excalibur a few times. It was over very quickly. Well, Arthur didn't really win the battle did he? Merlin did from the sidelines,athough he was late. Even though he managed to find his true potential in the cave, he wasn't able to do the magic-transportation thing that Mary Collins managed to do in the very first episode. So again, we have Merlin's magic depending on what the writers wanted to achieve, which in this episode wasn't much. Then we have Arthur getting separated from the rest of the knights - how did that happen?. Giaus suggesting the Sidhe to heal Arthur must be some kind of joke, twice they've been shown as trying to kill him. I can't imagine they would be interested in helping him, or Merlin at all. And then the long trek to Avalon. (Just why Merlin didn't call the dragon to start with is anyone's guess) . The whole encounter with Morgana was pretty disappointing, and what did she mean "no mortal blade can harm me?" Where did that come from? Gwaine and Percival going after her was never going to end well. There's other examples as well, But when you're watching or reading something that asks you to suspend your disbelief, and accept things like magic and dragons, but then doesn't follow up with logic in their own world, it becomes a bit too big an ask. I guess they though that by focusing on Merlin and Arthur and giving us the (non-important, according to them) magic reveal, the writers and producers felt they would be making the fans happy and giving them what they thought they wanted. (again, I obviously wasn't the intended audience for this relationship, as I think there where some negative aspects about their friendship so I really could never buy into it. I think that the writers gave us what they think is an"idealised romance", by having Merlin being always self-sacrificing, and obsessed about Arthur. I always thought that he was putting up with Arthur, so when the time came, he could push Arthur in the right direction of uniting Albion etc. I would like to add too, that not "believing in Merther", or whatever is not in anyway homophobic, that is a very simplistic label that many fans have thrown at others who do not agree with them. I simply think their relationship itself is problematic, in much the same way as Bella and Edward in Twilight, or other similar relationships are problematic, being two males doesn't come into it. I would much prefer proper representation of LGBT couples on television then the sort of things we get now) While I understand some people were truly happy with it, the vast majority I've come across thought it was horrible, badly written and completely heart-breaking at the same time. That final coda might have felt like a good idea at the time, playing around with the audience's perception of Merlin as old man, but really it didn't come across as very hopeful - more like he was tragically hanging around the Tor just waiting.
I'm not sure what else can be said about this final two-parter that hasn't already been said a thousand times over in other threads, and other forums. Yes, it felt very rushed as if they hadn't prepared at all. There were quite a few things that made little or no sense whatsoever. Again it felt as though the writers wanted to put in scenes or just have the actors say certain sentences just for effect, but it didn't matter if they were logical at all. Why else would you show the image of Merlin trapped in a cave, playing on the audiences knowledge of the legends with Merlin trapped beneath a Hawthorne tree, or within a cave. But how it happened - Morgana trapping him there when he was seeking to regain his magic by going to the cave in the first place is simply daft. The scene with Balinor is quite beautiful (although its very Star-Wars-y), but is rendered meaningless by the very scenes following it (where Merlin is in his old-man disguise). As for the battle itself, it felt to me as though they'd watched the movie Excalibur a few times. It was over very quickly. Well, Arthur didn't really win the battle did he? Merlin did from the sidelines,athough he was late. Even though he managed to find his true potential in the cave, he wasn't able to do the magic-transportation thing that Mary Collins managed to do in the very first episode. So again, we have Merlin's magic depending on what the writers wanted to achieve, which in this episode wasn't much. Then we have Arthur getting separated from the rest of the knights - how did that happen?. Giaus suggesting the Sidhe to heal Arthur must be some kind of joke, twice they've been shown as trying to kill him. I can't imagine they would be interested in helping him, or Merlin at all. And then the long trek to Avalon. (Just why Merlin didn't call the dragon to start with is anyone's guess) . The whole encounter with Morgana was pretty disappointing, and what did she mean "no mortal blade can harm me?" Where did that come from? Gwaine and Percival going after her was never going to end well. There's other examples as well, But when you're watching or reading something that asks you to suspend your disbelief, and accept things like magic and dragons, but then doesn't follow up with logic in their own world, it becomes a bit too big an ask. I guess they though that by focusing on Merlin and Arthur and giving us the (non-important, according to them) magic reveal, the writers and producers felt they would be making the fans happy and giving them what they thought they wanted. (again, I obviously wasn't the intended audience for this relationship, as I think there where some negative aspects about their friendship so I really could never buy into it. I think that the writers gave us what they think is an"idealised romance", by having Merlin being always self-sacrificing, and obsessed about Arthur. I always thought that he was putting up with Arthur, so when the time came, he could push Arthur in the right direction of uniting Albion etc. I would like to add too, that not "believing in Merther", or whatever is not in anyway homophobic, that is a very simplistic label that many fans have thrown at others who do not agree with them. I simply think their relationship itself is problematic, in much the same way as Bella and Edward in Twilight, or other similar relationships are problematic, being two males doesn't come into it. I would much prefer proper representation of LGBT couples on television then the sort of things we get now) While I understand some people were truly happy with it, the vast majority I've come across thought it was horrible, badly written and completely heart-breaking at the same time. That final coda might have felt like a good idea at the time, playing around with the audience's perception of Merlin as old man, but really it didn't come across as very hopeful - more like he was tragically hanging around the Tor just waiting.
Why they felt they had to end it by sticking with tradition by having Arthur killed (or the more common re-telling - being mortally wounded and taken of to Avalon in a barge by priestess's) at Camlann, I will never know.
Good to see someone mirroring my thoughts. I have quite a few myself and will return shortly to lay them down. Stand ready.
(Edited by IthinkThereforIam)
Not sure if anyone reads here anymore but here's my two, three.. ten cents on the show, the ending of the show and all things connected to story telling. (I might spend a few posts doing this because.. that's how I work at the moment)
First off: I believe in a few of things when it comes to ANY story telling activity.
1. You do what you promise to do. If you tell the reader/viewing audience that you are going to tell a story that will include certain things - YOU DO JUST THAT and nothing less. You can always do more, if the story allows you to.
2. You treat the characters with respect. This means that if you let the audience spend loads of hours together with your characters you HAVE TO tell the stories of these characters to the end and NEVER CHEAT your audience OR your story.
3. Stay true to your goal/end point. Get the story plotted/planned right from the start and work HARD towards that end.
4. Keep a VERY firm grip on your story when it comes to what you have told so far. You can not afford to forget things and put weird stuff into the story that really has no place in it because of previously told bits. This ties in to point 3.
There are more to this but I'll stop here. Now to what I feel about the story "Merlin"...
First off, I like it a lot because the creators managed to stay clear of the Crap River which consists of really lousy sci-fi/fantasy shows where the SFX and the cast just suck basketballs through garden hose. There's a very fine balance to maintain when you create story that needs more SFX than you can supply (due to cost). In some cases Merlin delivers some pretty bad SFX-sequences but for the most part the show manages to stear clear of Sea Quest or Starship Trooper 3 kind of crap.
The cast is also pretty well balanced with some really great anchor points in Anthony S Head and Richard Wilson and some really neat guest appearances from then future Game of Thrones actors.
Story-wise. It is like most shows today. The story advances slowly and out of 13 or so episodes you get 4 or 5 shows that really give you story. The rest is adventure and such. Not bad. If you went for the story alone without taking the common detours along the central storyline the show would be over in three episodes. I like detours!
The seasons show storylione progression and the characters become more and more fine tuned. Sadly the story writers start having issues with the story here and there. Most I can live with but what I can not live with is when laziness takes the helm and stears the vessel into trouble.
When you tell your audience many times over that certain things are very important, important enough to be repeated over the seasons, you really MUST follow through here. You must deliver what you have promised. Otherwise you suck basketball.
So.. at the end of this show it feels like a lot of stuff just went unsaid. And to top that off we get to see a Merlin walking in our world, smiling rougishly at the camera as he passes it on the same type of road John Rambo walks into town on in a story from the 70s.
I ramble a bit but I've got no time to revise right now.. I'll return to my narrative later. To flesh my reasoning out...
/IttIa
(Edited by IthinkThereforIam)
I also didn't enjoy the stupidity of the characters.. after the umpteenth
Merlin: "... there's something wonky here Gaius"
Gaius *looking a little dazzled*: "But why on earth would you think that? There's nothing much out of the ordinary here. *Doesn't spot gigantic dragon-like footprint with smoking magical residues*
At some point Gaius must begin to suspect foul play directly..
(Edited by A Fandom user)
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Okie dokie- here for the final time haha (well, for a while anyway)
This episode- well, I don't really like the ending either, it's depressing- also, I didn't like Eira- she was manipulative, and selfish- think of all Merlin and Gwaine did for her :O
I felt sorry for Merlin, Gwen, Arthur, Gaius, Percival, Gwaine, and yes, Mordred and Morgana throughout these episodes, and what they went through- I loved the killing scenes of the "bad guys" though- showing that there was still some compassion between them, and their former friends- still, RIP Mordred, Gwaine, Morgana and Arthur :(
Yeah, not the best series finale- but good enough
(Edited by Gleek:D)
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The ending was pretty bad, but not because it was a sad ending, but because it was badly written, especially when you take into account the rest of the series. I mean, I don't have a problem about Arthur dying in the end, but he should have died after he accomplished what prophecies told us he would. Or at least we need an explanation about why he didn't. Instead we have Arthur dying before the golden age, without united Albion, and with magic still banned. And the worst part is that the show doesn't even acknowledges that Arthur and Merlin have failed. We have the Dragon telling Merlin the opposite, with no real arguments at all for this conclusion, despite all failure evidence. And the part with immortal Merlin in our present day waiting for Arthur to raise again it's simply pathetic IMHO. It was't enough for Merlin to sacrifice his youth for an unfulfilled destiny, the show still has to made him waste thousands of years waiting for Arthur to be back. I mean, poor Merlin, let the guy to be free already!
As for the bromance, the relationship between Arthur and Merlin has been stagnated since the first 2 seasons. We have certain friendship between them, but this is developed early in the show. However, for all this time Arthur still doesn't acknowledges Merlin as his equal, and still bullies him and treats him as a servant. Some rushed declarations after the reveal meanwhile Arthur is dying are not enough to compensate for the lack of development in that area. So I can't understand why a Merthur shipper would be happy either. Not to mention that homosexuality doesn't even seem to exist in canon Camelot.
(Edited by Tabahta)
I just didn't enjoy the finale at all, too rushed and too open at the end. I also found the dialogue way too flowery. Merlin's obssession with Arthur becomes tedious by the end, especially the part where he basically dismisses everyone back in Camelot, and also decides without Arthur, Camelot doesn't mean anything to him anyway.
I thought Morgana's death was too rushed as well, I was no fan of her's in truth but one minutes Merlin is blaming himself for how she turns out, and then the next minutes he stabs her through the heart.
I really wanted to know what happened after Arthur's death in Camelot. How long did it survive? Was magic returned to the land? Did Gwen marry Sir Leon (a headcanon of mine!). Instead we just get a noisy dirty truck, what a disappointment.
(Edited by A Fandom user)
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I completely disagree about Morgana's death- the point was, that he acknowledges it was his fault that she became the way she did, but she was too far gone for any other option, but her death- I wish she'd had a redemption, believe me, but oh well
(Edited by Gleek:D)
Issy5209 wrote:
Why they felt they had to end it by sticking with tradition by having Arthur killed (or the more common re-telling - being mortally wounded and taken of to Avalon in a barge by priestess's) at Camlann, I will never know.
Well for one they had to end it that way or it would not have made for such a great plot because in this episode Arthur finds out Merlin has magic and if Arthur were to be saved that would mean the story continues with him knowing Merlin has magic and that wouldn't be as fun as Merlin going around hiding the fact that he has magic from Arthur so that he can protect him.
(Edited by A Fandom user)
Tabahta wrote:
As for the bromance, the relationship between Arthur and Merlin has been stagnated since the first 2 seasons. We have certain friendship between them, but this is developed early in the show. However, for all this time Arthur still doesn't acknowledges Merlin as his equal, and still bullies him and treats him as a servant. Some rushed declarations after the reveal meanwhile Arthur is dying are not enough to compensate for the lack of development in that area. So I can't understand why a Merthur shipper would be happy either. Not to mention that homosexuality doesn't even seem to exist in canon Camelot.
Tabahta, I agree with you that the relationship between Arthur and Merlin was difficult to fathom. Having re-watched all of the Series recently, I think that there is a major shift in the first half of S4 towards intimacy in their relationship, where they are almost on the level of open friendship. It takes a step back again after 'Lancelot du Lac', but this can be reasonably explained by Arthur's depression after losing Gwen. At the end of the 'Sword in the Stone' Merlin's show of extraordinary loyalty, and ,of course, vital role in keeping Arthur alive and helping him to regain faith in his ability, should have strengthened the relationship. However, in S5, their relationship inexplicably reverts back to where it was in S1. Arthur was at times cold and horrible towards Merlin in the final series, and it was clear that the warlock was jealous of the apparent friendship Mordred enjoyed with the king.
This ties in neatly with your point Lurker, about Merlin's 'obsession' with Arthur. The distant relationship between the two protagonists felt at odds with the outpouring of devotion in the 'Diamond of the Day.' Merlin's expression that he was always meant to be Arthur's servant and that everything that he did for him was out of devotion to the king, wasn't true according to the preceding narrative. Merlin saved Arthur's skin so many times so that the king would live long enough to create a land where magical users would be tolerated. Merlin, in a way, was a manipulator. He grew fond of Arthur along the path of his intended purpose, but the prince and later king, demonstrated in his treatment of his servant, that he was often undeserved of Merlin's loyalty. I think it is clear that Merlin felt this. At times, being the king's servant was demoralising and painful, but it was Merlin's conviction that he would create a better future with Arthur that kept him going. Their last moments together give the misleading impression that Merlin was rather happy with with status quo. Taking a more cynical view, I think that this may have been included to cover up how disjointed the ending felt with the rest of the narrative.
I like to think that Merlin returned to Camelot after Arthur's death. I would have liked to have seen this in the finale instead of the redundant and rather jarring scene of an elderly Merlin walking past Glastonbury Tor in modern day. Contrary to what the producers had intended, I found this scene depressing. The producers confirmed in an interview that magic was tolerated in Camelot by the Queen. This is subtly implied by Gwen when Gaius tells her about Merlin's magic.
Merlin, of all the TV shows I have seen, has a unique effect on me. If any other TV show had been so badly handled in its final chapter, I would not have remembered it so fondly. Five years since it ended, and I still am in love with the show.
(Edited by Lp456)